Originally posted by Jango Dudes It has to be done in patches as Anita is going for a job. Sub D are easy to handle its just a type of algorythm applied to polys at base level but I would advise against level edits without a doubt unless you are keeping the model as a subD surface once its finished. I would just cut in the necessary details at base level then jus go back and forth between SD and Poly til you're satisfied then convert, I usually convert at Level 1 over Division of 2. Happy New year _J i'm nt talking about anita's gig, just clarifing that subD in maya are not the best thing to work with. type "Subdivision Surfaces limitations" in the help docs to see what i mean, or in the MR docs to see MR's limitation with subDs in maya. i'd avoid patch modeling in every way, as it is non-intuitive and a slow process, and it too is difficult to handle on the basis of animation, rigging or texturing. and subD or poly can give similar results if modeled well enough. but a job's a job. good luck with it.