G... Sorry for the late reply was busy yesterday. Updates look nice, love the pipe work, very Geiger! Did you use a script for the pipe or lots of extrudes and a bend deformer? I would just darken the cars on the left in the picture to save re- renders, that should keep the eye away from there, the shot isnt about them so to me its no big a deal. Yes, Im with you all the way Gio with that comment. Its a hell of a lot of work, its also something that I want both of us to achieve, no matter the content and whose is better than whose. The personal satisfaction of getting this done will be immense and also a middle fingered salute to those non believers. Gio knows exactly who Im refering to here, we worked under severe conditions and an iron fist in this type of work a while back, we knew what we could achieve but were always told NO! Im afraid the time has come to prove those people wrong....... I seek, the means to fight injustice.....oops getting carried away now:bandit: Jay