Proposed Topology thread change.

[j5ive]

Is it worth maybe creating two Topology threads, one that contains solid topology examples for users to reference but not add replies to, and one thats a WIP topology thread, for ppl who are asking for help and guidance in their topology layout that post their current work there for the experienced to guide and photoshop over the top of? Then if/when the topology is at a solid mesh it can be added to the Completed topology reference sticky? Just a thought as I, personally find it beneficial to follow a few proven methods of topology rather than plough it alone then end up with a mesh that I basically have to overhaul. This way the distiction between wip (not completely stable) and finished (great references) is much clearer than currently.

Just an idea.

[Jay]

Interesting, but thats the point of having your own thread and posting your WiP hence not ploughing it alone and finishing before youve asked a question, the topo sticky is there for people to pop in and learn, see meshes that may help and ask questions.

Thats the whole point of it being in the WiP section, you can pop in there and have a look and ask, then put theory into practice. Who cares if you muck it up and have to overhaul areas, we all do it. Thats how we learn, NO SHORT CUTS!

_J

[j5ive]

Yeah, I understand your point but in reference to 'Thats how we learn, NO SHORT CUTS! ' I think it would be foolish for ppl not to use pre-completed topology as references, we use image planes as references to aide with our accurate modelling so why hinder yourself by trying to create decent topology from scratch when you can have readily available references? Obviously once someone is proficient in creating 'their' own style of completed topology then the reference wouldn't maybe be required. I wouldn't drive my car blindfolded because I know the way home without looking ;) . Not having a dig at your thread Jay. :beer:

[gster123]

Right... think I get what you mean, Instead of say a "Place Human Ref Pics Here" thread you mean to have a "Topology Reference Thread" where people can grab a front and side topology pic to use as say reference or even as an image plane?


Edit - Think that you could just go throught the exisiting thread and find pics in there that you could use. I see what your getting at if the aboves right.

[j5ive]

Yeah, I just thought it would be of help to a few users, as I know I would have found it helpful when I first started organic modelling, even now I keep open a previous topology mesh in the background to check every so often. Maybe it's just me :confused: lol.

[Jay]

j5ive

I know you arent having a dig mate, no problem. But if you had said a references thread in the first place that may be useful.

Well lets do it then!! Where shall we have it? WiP, Lounge?

Also we'd need to specify images etc, cant have copyrighted stuff

Jay

[gster123]

Im all for it but the thing is to me is who's going to specify that its "reference Quality"?

Thats the problem that I could see. As everyones topologys different, the basics are the same Loops, anatomy etc but the poly placment, n gons/no n gons, pole positions etc etc, different for different people.

Otherwise, unless its regulated in some way to say "industry Standard" its going to end up being lots of pictures of everyones work (unless this is the Idea) Which would make it a bit confusing, in my view???

Just a thought on the matter.

[Jay]

Yeah good point, perhaps more thought on the issue before proceeding, the one we have now is enough for the time being...


Cheers Steve

Jay

[j5ive]

Yeah, I can see your point gster, if this is to go ahead then maybe to clarify the 'quality' should be a topology mesh that will cause no problems when rigged other than the usual painting weights to resolve, or one that still is a solid mesh when subdivided. The idea of this is not only for facial references but anything organic, like ears which people regularly struggle with, hands, feet, etc.

[vladimirjp]

why dont u ust make a library of generic body parts -like mopst people have- that u can easily use on any character
i still dont get what ur asking...

[Jay]

He basically is asking for completed mesh references of 'good models' to use. So loops are right etc ,to save time modeling and get allegedly correct joint deformation.

My problem is this is not learning as such but merely a shortcut to save time when th hard work has been done.

Jay

[dave_baer]

You don't need a whole section dedicated to reference images. But it's not a bad idea to start a thread for it. Heck, I'll even make it STICKY! :D

Then you can post links to reference material in it.

I thought we had a thread like that already... Hmmm... Can't seem to find the darn thing.

Ah well...

[Acid44]

why not just use the existing tutorial and blueprint links forum:confused:

EDIT: whered it go????:confused:

[Jay]

I'd be worried about reference material having copyright stuff on it, people can be real dickheads over stuff like this even when its as innocent as reference material..

Just a thought

Jay

[dave_baer]

Originally posted by Jay
I'd be worried about reference material having copyright stuff on it, people can be real dickheads over stuff like this even when its as innocent as reference material..

Just a thought

Jay

Yeah, you gotta be careful what you're doing when it comes to other peoples photos. But usually, for reference, it's not that big a deal. People won't generally sue you for modeling a car that they took a photo of.

And as far as posting the links here, I think the biggest issue would be bandwidth useage. Of course you would have to post the link to the image, not the image itself linked from the original website.

But other than that, I don't see a problem with it. But Kevin or Dave might want to chime in on this one. After all, they run the site, so ultimately it's up to them.

Hmmm... Where did that blueprints thread go? :confused:

[Jay]

Hi Dave

Yeah absolutely, I cant see it as a problem, my worry really was aimed at people who might subscribe to 3dSK for their reference material and then post it here innocently. Their stuff is copyrighted, so it was things like that, that was the concern.

Yeah if David could chime in that would be cool!! DAAAAVEEE!!

Cheers
Jay

[j5ive]

Just to clarify, I originally meant for a thread of topology (shaded wireframe shots, orthographic views) as references, not actual facial/body photo's, as obviously that would infringe on many persons copyright like you say 3dSK for one. I do not wish to pinch any photo references as google is full of stuff, or if I cannot source the reference I sought, I will take the photos digitally myself.

Apologies for not making my original post clear.

[DrRobotnik]

I'm gonna back J5 on this one.

I've been using the topo thread a fair bit (god knows i need it!). But instead of just using fine examples to make a new thread it would be good to see the comments on peoples mistakes to learn from them. Perhaps when the thread gets long winded it would be an idea to cut it up, reorder and make a purely reference thread that has ordered questions, examples and responses so you don't have to scroll all over the place to view relevant images and the same issues aren't addressed all over the place.

Pete

[vladimirjp]

Originally posted by j5ive
Just to clarify, I originally meant for a thread of topology (shaded wireframe shots, orthographic views) as references,

huh?

whats the difference to the current topology thread?
doesnt sound like you are looking for refs...

[Jay]

Yeah I agree, it sounds more like it every time I read this thread, time to close it...

Jay

[gster123]

Yeah, thats was what I was thinking.

For the record I think it would be good to see a topology thread sticky in a "universal WIP" section on the new site, so other softwares can post up rarther than just one software.

[dave_baer]

As to the copyright issue, obviously the thread would have to be moderated tightly. Any occurance of copyrighted images would have to be deleted and those posting them would be warned. Any further occurances by the same individual would then be dealt with by the strike of my mighty mouse button and the BAN setting. :D

[Jay]

Not the BAN!! Hmmm I like your style, Mr Baer! Cunning to say the least...

gster...I think universal topo thread is good, once the site merges thats a good idea. As topo is more an arbitary issue anyway so that would make sense.

We'll keep things as is for now, without adding confusion. After all its a 'Simply' site :bandit:

Jay