A New theory -who is god?
 

Im sure alot has been debated on who is God,... Im a Christian, and no, this is not going to be a Christian talk. And no, I don't believe everything I say. With that aside...

I once heard a saying somewhere that went something like this

"world war 3 will be fought with nukes, world war 4 with sword and sticks."

That got me into thinking. A nuke war would probably be aimed at cities or army base, enemy technology research centers, etc. So a nuclear war could be able to wipe out wipe out most of technolody. All the smart ppl would probably die in the blast or later from not being able to survive in the harsh envirnment that the nukes would have caused. So the indians and "cave men", the "simple" ppl who learned how to live without going to the supermarket would have a better chance of survival than the rest of us. U follow? Ok so, 10-6 thousand years ago say, (i don't dig these "millions of years ago") technolodgy had advanced beyond today's and the world was in the virge of chaos. The superpowers fighting for control of the world, bin laden on the lose causing chaos... u know... kinda like today. One bad day at the congress someone pushes the "red button". Nukes fly, the other country retaliate and send their nukes. Explosions here and there, ppl dieing and technolodgy drops in a few seconds. Man at that point, got too clever for his own good. Half the world destroyed and millions of clever brains lost. Some clever ppl could have survived in a secret labaratory, or escaped of to space. Remember, these ppl of the past were much more technolodicaly advanced than us today. So maybe a single mad scientist survided and went of to space. This guy could already live for ever, not need to breath or sleep. etc. Even go to different dimensions. Maybe he invented the dimensions... And in the backward times after the nuke blast, he being the mad scientist who knew nothing but his work would find it amusing to walk among the indians and cave men and do "miracles and wonders" with the technolodgy he had saved with him. He was GOD! Never really given to much attention for his work in the past,now could be worshiped by all man kind. But ofcourse too much of anything gets boring, so he opted to stay in the shadows more, and watch mankind progress in technolodgy again. Maybe he's studing us from behind the moon. Maybe thats his new work. Or maybe abandoned earth and went somewhere else. And now we're here progressing in technolody and weapons of mass distruction again. Maybe its true when they say history repeats itself. Maybe the cavemen of today are going to be the better off tomorow. They are the ones who would push humanity back up on its feet. And keep the human race from extinction. Not we clever idiots who are building our own gallows to hang from. :eek:
Every theory must have evidence that could support it.
This is my evidence: scientist believe there was an Ice Age. How was it cause. This would go hand in hand with my theory because after the nuclear war, dust would have filled up the sky and blocked the suns heat from reaching the ground. I also saw once that egyptions drawings showed what appeared to be electricity being used to help mumify bodies. This could have been in result to a "a electricianer" of the past teaching his kids how to make electricity. And the knowledge was passed on through generations.

Any comments and or "holes" u see in my theory please let me know about it. lol

Re: A New theory -who is god?
 

Well first of all: gr8 for u being a christian :beer: i am too.

Now-

Don't you think that there would have been leftover huge blast traces? Enourmous shifts in the sandstone layers (which is what tends to happen after 1 megaton+ blasts).

Also, the Ice Age was already proved to be the result of a primeval global warming- the polar ice caps melting little by little, the salt in the oceans dissolving little by little, the earth heating up little by little, until alot of the salt in the oceans was dissolved. Then, nothing to keep the water above freezing, so it starts. The entire thing freezes until it starts melting little by little, melting back into just the polar ice caps, and continuing melting at a rate, idk, 10000 times faster than before because of our pollution, etc.

The electricity- you know how the first batteries were made? a zinc layer on the outside, a copper layer on the inside, acid in between, a copper rod on the copper layer- and a few volts of electricity are made.

You know, they descovered a jar, which had evidence of iron, copper, and acid (like lemon juice) in it? That was found in the Middle East, and estimated to be made in or around 800BC. Uhoh, a battery in 800 bc.

What could it have been used for? Well, possibly to give shocks to people like signs of gods, cuz, the people wouldnt know what electricity was so when they get a shock, they experience "god".

Or they could have thought that it was useful to give a dead body a 2-3 volt shock... people back then were wierd.

Also- wouldn't we find any ruins of ancient skyscrapers? No ruins of anceint super-advanced cities? No ruins of ancient streets ANYWHERE? I mean, something would be left behind, no matter what...

thats the holes that I see
Matt :alien:

Re: A New theory -who is god?
 

this had me laughing all day

God is only a clever little scientist that escaped chaos.:lmao:

This is just too funny:attn: :attn: :attn: :attn: :attn:

I personally don't believe in God. I am not religious or believe in any religions. That's all.


Tiago2 , your theory really cracks me up
:attn: :attn:

By far the funniest thing i've heard( you were trying to be funny right?).

hulkis2001, 13th_resident, Im disapointed in u lot. This is serious matter. God could be not as alien as we once thought. :P lol
MattTheMan, for the sake of argument I think I'll have to try to "correct" you of the holes u see in my theory. lol hmm

*edited*

Mattheman Im glad u know how to make a battery, simple huh? But u didn't discovere it yourself. Someone did b4 u. Now if u didn't know how to make one, much less that one could even be made... u'd never have figured it out. All to say that battery may have been a cheep immitation of electrity back then. As for the ice age, it was cause by global warming u say. Over a long period of time? Y not suddenl Blasts from the super nukes could melt it in a second. Hey the oceans probably reset even. I mean. The ocean is just one big giant whole in the ground. no what if before the whole there were stuff on top. u follow? A city and sivilisation, when the nukes went off they blew away chunks of earth into poweder that blocked the sun's light and eventially settled down accros the whole world. The cities were where the oceans are now. Hey it could have been? lol I can't believe Im actually arguing this. U ever hear that the earth is wobbling? It is, like if u were to spin a ball at its axis and throw a rock at it, the ball would keep spinning but it start to wobble. Understand. Well the earth is wobbling a bit. The nukes could have done this. With the amount of technolodgy they had...
Maybe I'll start a religian. Who want to be a follower. lol.

peace
:attn:

me!!!!!!!!
lol

I got one question Tiago2
How was the world that the scientist came from made?:confused:


other then that your theory is awsome.

Well, someone had to have figured it out at some point, I don't see why that couldn't be ancient egyptians instead of aliens...

Also, I still think that any kind of civilization would leave traces, no matter how devastation it's destruction was. However, it wouldn't _have_ to be like anything we know today, as it was questioned in a previous post...

As for the ice age, I think it could have happened because of dustclouds from a nuclear war (not saying I believe it though), but again, a nuclear war would have made pretty much all of the planet contaminated, and thereby impossible to inhabit by anything for a very, very long time!

Apart from those things, and the fact that the idea of an immortel scientist floating around in space or in another dimension is a bit too far fetched for my liking, I think it's an interesting theory you've come up with...

And for the record, I'm not religious...

'nuff said. :alien:

Well yes I see your point there and I haven't thought about that yet. So you found a pretty good hole in my theory... then again, there's some caves that people go into, it takes days for them to get really inside. With all their highteck equipment, and when they get there they see cavemen like paintings in the wall. you seeing where Im going? The world must have been too contaminated for people to live in the surface so they migrated underground. They even find beriuls in some of these tunnels. Why were those people there, is what they always ask. Well that question is could be answered with my theory.

These will not answer your questions but it's a good place to start. If you believe in the bible the first thing you should do is open your mind and question all your thoughts, just don’t take a persons word for your own beliefs, question every thing and every one and come up with your own answers. If I may suggest a website for you to go to, it’s a free thought site, they have weekly pod shows, where Theist debate Atheist and talk about every thing.

Infidleguy

You know what R-Tillery? You are dam RIGHT! Even with our new knowledge of science and tecnology most people don't question the religions. What would you believe something someone tells you, especially if it's thousands of years old? You know things weren't the same as they are now?

Next time someone shoves their religion facts down your throat, question them. Think if it's really right. Think about it hard. Don't believe in something someone tells you to. That's not right. Make your own mind and do what you want to do, not because somebody wants you to do. You life is your not anyone elses. You are going to make decisions and live with those decisions. Don't depend on a book to tell you what's right and wrong. Don't believe in God if billions of people do. If you are born Christian, Muslim or Jew that doesn't mean you have to be one of them. It's your choice. Onces you look away from the religions, you will know exactly what i'm talking about.

Last thing. Wouldn't there be ALOT less violence and crimes if none of the religions or God existed? For one we wouldn't be having this War. The war started because of terrorists. What created the terrorists? Islam? What is Islam? It's a religion. So if the religions didn't existed, we would have alot more freedom.


By the way, i'm atheist.



;)

While it would be nice to think that a world without religion would be without violence, I just don't think it would be true - Look at Mao...

I just think that blaming religion for violence is far too easy.

hey man, its not God who makes the violence.

us ppl were not made to be puppets. we have freedom of choice to do as we will.
now "Choice" whoa that is something powerful. how do you know what is right or wrong hulkis? If there is no god then who makes all the rules? (well then it must be us humans)
do you base your logic/choices on Majority Opinion? do you base your logic/choices on what Congress says?

How can you tell what is "Right" or "Wrong"??

ok hulkis next friday iam going to knock on your house. once you open the door I am going to blow your head away with a automatic shotgun and steal all your valuables and not even feel bad about it because since there is no god I make all rules. and my conscience says its ok to kill you.


Shame on you.

I wont debate you here about that statement, but read the bible and what God told Mosses army’s to do and the reasons why and he goes on to do it to others as well.

I don't mind friendly debate, but just as long as it stays FRIENDLY.

Just a little reminder from your friendly neighborhood mod and aimed at no one in particular... just these topics can get very touchy...

Rogger that ;)

Ok listen, Im not questioning my beliefs witht this theory, anyone can see this is ridiculous. I just want to see how far I can take it. For the fun of it. Like alot of stuff these days, Its all imagination. You take a bit of truth (eg. painting in deep tunnels) and mix it up with alot of nothing but peer imagination. Thats all it is.

You say religion created the terrorist. Well it wasn't islam. People created them. The palestinians for exaple. They're all muslims. They live in their nice cosy homes until someday some pricks come by and take them out of their house at gun point. Ok, its sad. Some might tolerate that even. Then they're givin a curfew in their own land by foeigners. How would u feel if u were in their shoes. Maybe they lost family unjustly. Like the story about the dad who's kid got shot going to school. Similer sercomstances might build up hate in a person and drive them to do terrorist acts. Its not islam fault. Im not muslim but I don't think Islam encourages terroism.

I read the Bible and their were reasons for why God commanded his ppl to do some of those act. Most of the times it were judgement for the idol worshipers. But that was the Old Testament. Read the New Testament. The way Jesus taught us to live. "Love your enemies" "Do good to them that hate you". Thats God's New commandmen. Thats the way Christians ought to live. Theirs no hate in their.

First of all, I'd be careful of accusing any religion of spawning terrorists... Keep in mind that one man's terrorist is another man's freedomfighter. Just take look at the IRA. How strong do you think their faith in Islam were?

And 13th_resident, shame on you for not respecting that not all people have the same beliefs as you... :shakehead

Huumm,, So your saying it was a good thing that god told his army to go forth and kill every man / woman / infant and animal because of there sin? Those must have been some really bad babies and animals to be put to death.;)

And doesn’t Jesus say I come not bringing peace but a sword and to hate your mother and brother and let the dead bury the dead? :confused:

just checking;)

Respect!!!!! what the h..ll.
of course i respect religions and beliefs.
i live in a town where 40 percent of the ppl here are muslims (those 40 percent consists of afghans, pakistanis and VERY VERY FEW kuwaitians and iraqis ), and 50 percent are indians and sri lankans.
i've got muslims friends.
when i see my friends or other ppl praying to allah i dont go up to them and start cussing them. or go saying there religion is stupid.


yes i want to make this a friendly forum and conversation. tiago2 theory is dumb (and funny).
i just got a little bit out of hand when he said i dont respect beliefs.
bloomkall you shouldnt always jump to conclusions of what ppl say. yes i did sound like i was against his beliefs. but it was more of a joke. i dont go around converting ppl to christianity. i dont go to church. perhaps your're taking this thread a bit to seriously.

13th, I'm not jumping to conclusions, I was just referring to your comment on Hulkis being an atheist... What's wrong with being an atheist?

Let's not start a war please.

It doesn't matter what we believe in, as long as each and everyone of us do the right thing. That's what really matters.


Now all i have to ask is, how come you believe in God when you can't even see him or him even showing a sign of his existen? I just want your opinions that's all. I want to know the reason behind it.;)

Hulkis is right, and what I said probably came out more harsh than I meant it to... I'm just curious how one who accepts that people believe in different Gods can't seem to accept that some people believe in no God?

I'm not accusing you of discrimination or anything 13th, but that's how your reply seemed to me... Just curious is all... ;)

No hard feelings from my part :beer:

then lets all just get along. ;) :beer: ;)

Ok now to put this forum post back on track. First off I see a lot of holes in your story. If you believe in God and are a Christian, then he made the earth 5,000 years ago, not enough time to create any modern technology that we have today. If we were looking for such advancements (And we Have) we would be finding it in Africa according to scientist, but we haven’t, that’s because the people back then were to busy attending to their masters and worshiping them. People back then did not have the mental capacity to be as smart as we are today.

Now about the Ice age. This statement blows the theory of God out of the way because of the time frame. Scientist have found with fact that this took place over millions of years ago from carbon dating and from ice cores and fossils. So it would be hard to make any kind of technological advancement in that time frame.

Now as for your Nuke Hypothesis,, Man you should become a SiFi writer, cause that story is way out there. I mean like L.Ron Hubbert stuff. With out any way to prove such a theory, this might sound a little odd. If a person could be as advanced as you said that this person could go thru different dimensions, then what would keep him from going back in time to stop the war from even happening? Your theory don’t hold water..

If it weren’t for the dark ages, we would be more advanced then what we are. Over 8 hundred years in that time frame if any one was to make any kind of technological advancement would be considered of hearsay and burned as a witch. So we putted along as we did till this day.;)


Thats just my take on it:beer:

You know who God really is? US! Yeah, we are God. But we are God only if we're "ONE". Do you see where i'm going? If every human on this planet learn to coperate, respect each others, help each others and work together, puting our races and colors aside. Imagine what we can accomplish? We'd be unstopable. If you really think about it, that really makes sense. If we believe in each other, show respect and do the right thing, then we are winners. This world be much much better place. Close to perfect i say.


Sadly half the world has gone crazy. Actually most of us has. Now days it's all about money, power, oil.....ect. This is what we are fighting for each and everyday. Bush and terrorists go bomb the hell out of each other for this. All this is doing is killing inecent people in the center who clearly has nothing to do with the war. Men, women, children, babies have died and are dying in the middle east. That's a shame expecially when they are completly inecent of any crimes. There is no good side in this way. No way in hell Bush is good and no way in hell terrorists are good. Good people don't fight.

This 911 that happened. I feel so sorry for the families that lost their loved ones in the WTC bombing. I don't know if it were the terrorists who did or american government planned it. But who ever blew the towers and killed thousands of inecent people is a no good son of a B****H! Sorry for the swaring but they deserve it. It must feel terrible to loose someone you love.

Frankly Bush and the terrorists don't understand that. That's just my opinion. Read the first paragraph.....again. That's how i want the world to be.:beer:

See, that's what I think is wrong. As long as we all do what's right. So... there is no God, let's say. Then who makes the rules? Who establishes what is "right" and what is "wrong"? Can you tell me? Can government tell you? Then, who tells them? They tell eachother. But they will always disagree on something. That is because what they decide isn't allways what EVERYONE decides.

Therefore there will allways be disagreement- unless there is an ultimate lawgiver- God.

Ok, there is no God. Explain me this- can you rise from the dead? I HIGHLY doubt it. But, if you insist you can, can I go and beat the crap out of you, then nail you to a cross and sticking a spear between your ribs?

Ok, that happened about 1975 years ago (Jesus died at around 33 years of age).

So, what about miracles. I know- you will deny them first chance you get.

How do you explain a person with terminal colon cancer getting instsntly well, with the cancer completly leaving them? Or, howabout a person that is dead, proclaimed dead, but comes back? How about dying people- they claim to see loved ones.

Ok- I don't care if this makes my reputation go down - I stand up for what I think is right.

The only way that could happen is if we all were perfect. unfortunatly, we are not all "good" on the inside. We all have sinful natures. Some people are really close to being perfect (like mother Teresa), but the only way they manage to do that is by obeying God's commandments.


our sinful natures- none of us is born "good".

I don't say that. Bush claims he is a Christian, but, honestly I disagree.

According to carbon dating? And ice cores? Alot is being said that carbon dating does not work for more than 50,000 years. So it would be nearly impossible to date millions of years with that method. (http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD011.html). Ice cores also has its draw backs. Annual rings found in ice cores aren't anual rings at all. After watching the seminars found in http://www.drdino.com/downloads.php I have a new outlook on scientist's proclamations. I took the liberty to upload the section where he talks about Annual rings just for u. Feel special. lol. This guy is a Scientist with a PHD and whatnot. He discredits evolution and similer theories like there's no tomorow. All with scientific evidence. If nothing else its interesting to hear a different argument for the age of the earth. Heres the link to the annual rings section, @ 3.4MB. http://rapidshare.de/files/18456648/...Rings.wmv.html

Thanks for stating the obvious. But to defend my theory...lol...
Maybe it wasnt possible to go back in time. Maybe we only get one chance and what we do now is done. There's no second chances to go back in time and fix our mistakes. Even with all that technolodgy the mad scientist still wasn't able to turn back the hands of time. It a one way ride and there is no reversing.

The Information you should me is out dated and wrong. Here are a couple of sites to go thru.
http://www.radiocarbon.org/Journal/v37n1/vartanyan.html

http://www.c14dating.com/int.html

And any thing from Kent Hovind is a complete joke. That guy believes that Dinosaurs and man lived peacefully together after they got off Noah’s arc. Please don’t tell me you believe him or any thing you say after will fall short of intelligent conversation.

I’m still waiting for a response form Dr. Pigliucci on carbon dating in strata that came from space. As soon as I get it Ill put it up.

if you want to visit the site heres the site.
http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...imo_pigliucci/

If any one likes debates here’s a link of one, Todd Friel and Dan Barker. It’s one of the most popular debates on the existence of god. Both guys put up a good argument and it’s very entertaining. It’s a free podcast so you can download it or just open it up.

http://www.wotmradio.com/2006/04/04/...barker-debate/

I believe the Bible and Kent Hovind argument is based on the Bible so alot of stuff he says goes along side my beliefs? And how is he a joke? His arguments are well formed and in debates I've seen its not him but the the other scientists that appear the "jokes".
Thanks for the links to "On the existance of God". Im always interested in debates like these. :P

So what you're saying is that God exists since there's no disagreement in the world?

I remember hearing that there were proof that Jesus actually lived and walked the Earth, but not that he actually rose from the dead... If you've got some, other than what it says in the Bible, you're more than welcome to share...

I think you meant to say "Some people are really close to being perfect christians" since you're referring to being perfect according to christian values and beliefs...

Just my $0.02 :)

Cheers :beer:

Dude, theres always disagreement in the world, look at wars, crimanal laws, politics etc .

Here's my two cents:

Why I Am Not A Christian . . .

Bertrand Russell once wrote a book "Why I Am Not A Christian" which I felt was quite lacking in substance, considering the title . . . . I thought it would be interesting to write about it . . . .

Before I get into this issue, I must warn you that if you are a christian and are easily offended, do not read this. If you disregard this warning and continue, don't blame me for this, I have warned you . . .

Many people, including those who profess Christianity and many other religions, believe that theirs is an omnipotent God, who created the universe, who is "love". To them I would simply ask this question......... If you could create a universe, and you were indeed the embodiment of love, would you create one in which beings of that world would prey upon other beings.......a world where it is necessary for beings to consume other life in order to live? I think not.

Now, suppose that you go to your doctor because you are sick, and after the usual check-in, you are brought to the examination room. When your doctor comes in, there may be the short bit of small-talk, then he asks you what it is that is wrong. So you tell him, and then, to your complete astonishment, he says "Unless you acknowledge to me, that I am a doctor, and address me as Dr. _____, I will not treat you." I think that the average person, with any common sense, would not wait around to be treated by that so-called doctor! This anology can be applied to Jesus. Why does he insist that others acknowledge his title? Would someone with a normal bearing in life, having a title, (as would a true doctor) feel a need to have their title acknowledged?

When there is a great social stigma attached to a particular thing, it is not uncommon for people to do everything they can to hide this stigma from society. The psychological term, I believe that would be applied, is called repression. One represses what would other-wise cause them pain by acknowledging it to themselves or to others. It is said that Jesus was oft-times considered to be an illegitimate child. What better way to attempt to convince others that you were indeed of legitimate birth, lacking any other proof, than to claim to have decended from god himself! So much for immaculate conception.

The idea of "original sin" is preposterous, from a humanistic perspective, and from a realistic perspective. It is simply a dinosaur that was carried from the past, when the disgrace of an individual was considered the disgrace of every generation afterward. The average person does not hold things against children who error due to ignorance or the errors of their ancestors...........they may punish them as a way to keep them from dangers......but they do not hold this against them for the rest of their lives or for eternity, for that matter. One does not learn, without making errors. But I think that there are plenty of people who prefer to keep others in a non-enlightened state.

I think that the dissemination of lies is motivated by greed. If you can convince a bunch of people to believe, you can also convince them to give, once you do that, you have become the parasite who harvests from these poor deceived souls.

Some people are just lazy..............they don't want to even take the time to actively try to be of any benefit to humanity, so they give their money to the priest, whom they assume (a lot of times falsely) will do good for them, or at the very least, absolve them............. These priests are suppose to be wise men and are suppose to give guidance to the general public . . but most of them are also suppose to live a life of semi-seclusion and remain a virgin all their lives. If I want to learn how to fire a cannon, I'll go to someone who has done it, thank you.

I cannot see any sense in attaching oneself to a doctrine. When you become so rigid in defending these doctrines, as do many people, you then lock out all other possibilities.........and many of the doctrines that exist are inflexible and assumming.....they are assumming because they tend to make a lot of claims which cannot be proven. Once most people write all their doctine in stone, and then cling to it like it is their last thing on earth, they become rigid, unbending, and uncompromising. They close the door to exploration.

I think that any idea of eternal damnation runs against what love is suppose to be........Who could imagine a parent so pernicious as to condemn their children to suffer eternally? Yet, when this idea is supported by biblical text, it seems to be ok to people....... Love is not something that is conditional, based upon someones behavior, in my opinion. If you really do indeed love someone, conditions are irrelevant. As Nietzsche would say, "Whatever is done from love occurs beyond good and evil".

Some people just assume automatically that an athiest has no moral compass . . . but are the above statements impling lack of moral compass, or a penchant for the truth, regardless of the palatibility of it?

The Antichrist, one of Nietzsche's best works, is still very relevant today . . .

I don't know what u would consider as proof but their is the shourd. It kinda looks like a negative from a camera but on a piece of cloth. Maybe a suden surge of energy or light could have done it. http://www.shroud.com/.

Wasn't the Turin Shroud carbon dated to be the middle ages rarther than at the time of Christ?

Biblicaly speaking, God did not create a world like that. U're seeing the world as it is now and saying that God made it this way. If u saw a mashed-up Toyota Supra on the side of the road, would u then think, "why did Toyota make a supra like that?". I think not. Toyota didn't make it like that, it happened after it was made. God made the world and gave charge for man to take care of it, and man pretty much did the opposite. At the end of creation God saw what he had created and "it was good". God made a perfect world. Human kind destroyed it.

Its been proven in 2005 that the piece they used to carbon date back in 1988 wasn't part of the real showd but a fix up of a fire that nearly destroyed the shoroud back in 1500ths.
http://www.shroud2000.com/CarbonDatingNews.html