Thanks guys.... I'm still going to be here...jeez this place is my home website....Im a shut in!! Besides everyone here isso friendly...I know we get the occasional riff raff who wont take advice...but really for the most part they are few and far between. Its always a pleasure to pass on knowledge...as I always tell people that are new to 3d...there wasnt an internet or tutorials when I started so it was all from the software manuals...15 of them in the old alias/wavefront setup for maya back in the day!!! cheers boys n girls Jay