oh darkware, thanks for the picture. but i have a question about the mouth area. is the outside just one edge in U direction and the both V directions meet just below the lips, and the seam of the lips is the other U direction curve? Originally posted by Dann What if I wanted to keep the model as NURBS? then you just leave it as NURBS, as darkware pointed out: After you model this head, you can either leave the patches unstiched and bind the skin as-is, stich the patches then bind the skin