It's shaped up really nicely dave since last time I looked, good work. For that Jerry can I think you sparked the idea of how you'd go about making one in pretty much everyone who saw it, i don't even like modeling and I found myself intrigued enough to sit down and start pulling some vertices...difference is that I lost my patience and dropped the whole thing straight away And we're open for plenty of coffee breaks around here, in fact it's pretty much all we got done in the past few days, endless amounts of coffee I got so inspired I recorded a tutorial on how to render a cup of it, it was also a much more suitable project for my limited modeling skills than jerry cans...