Well I added some lights and some blinn`s to the scene and this is what I got https://www.ravage3d.com/images/horde/wip_3_1.jpg https://www.ravage3d.com/images/horde/wip_3_2.jpg As you can probably guess quite happy with the results but it has shown up one or two problem areas that I`m going to have to fix. But render times were in the seconds = me very happy Half way through folk