i have been looking over this thread and thought it worth mentioning the fsce loops that form the arch around the mouth ... some have it right some have it wrong but my point is that it should run over the top of the nasal arch as in "weyu's" and not into the arch like a few of the previous ... it seems like a small thing but you will stare at it for days trying to work out why it just aint right and gees its a bugger to try and fix later (dont i sound like the voice of experience ... not posting drawing as the previous posts sought of show it