Yeah been using the help files although I seem to be going wrong somewhere and don't understand why. I will keep trying since I know this is real easy like everything else once you know how to do it. I cannot help but think teaching myself all this has made life very hard and that UNI would of probably been a real good idea. Guess I will find out when I finally get this done and see if all that I have managed to learn is enough to get me a job in the industry. Thanks for your help Gster and will hopefully suss this real soon. Thanks, Leon Labyk